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 Should We Start Planning\Discussing the League for SO7 

Do We Need Novice Races in a NH League
Yes 55%  55%  [ 6 ]
No 45%  45%  [ 5 ]
Total votes : 11

 Should We Start Planning\Discussing the League for SO7 
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Post Should We Start Planning\Discussing the League for SO7
I know an SO7 league is a long time away but I was thinking why not start now and plan for the future of the league. This first discussion is about the National Hunt side of the league.

Firstly a Question.

Do we need Novice races?

In my case there was no real difference between the horses I uploaded as Novices and the the horses I uploaded as Open horses. They all had the same training and ran in the same kind of races in my main game. They were Novices in name only.

I have made a couple of assumptions when making this schedule up:

1. There was probably only about 10 trainers who actually won a Group race
2. The majority of trainers had horses in the 110 - 140 rating
3. The bottom 10 -15 trainers had horses rated less than 100.

If my assumptions are wrong, we can rivise them.

I have based the schedule below on 36 races per week. 10 group races where the top trainers can run their best horses, 18 races for the middle handicap horses and 8 races for horses at the bottom of the handicap.

In each race category I reckon we need a set of 8 races:

2 miles - one hurdles, one chase, 2m 4f one hurdles, one chase, 3 miles one hurdles, one chase, 3m 4f one chase, 4m+ one chase.

Hopefully, every horse will have a race to run in every week.


The group races:

It doesn't matter if you call races G1 or G2 or G3, the top trainers will always have runners in them. I have assumed that all races will be Open, no novice races.

Each week we will have the 8 races described above over hurdles\fences plus two extra races. These could be at distances like 2m 2f or 2m 6f. If we make each group race eligible for two runners then the top trainers could be guaranteed 20 runners.

Lastly, should there be a minimum handicap set for group races? Maybe 120.


The Middle Handicap Races

I envision these 18 races being split into two lots of 8 races. Again a hurdles\jumps race over each of the standard distances but with limits set on the handicaps

Perhaps one set of 8 races with am maximum handicap of 160 and a minimum handicap of 120 and eight races with a max handicap of 130 and no minimum handicap.

There would be two spare races for the big handicaps like the National or the Hennesay etc..


The Lower handicap races

This would consist of 8 races over hurdles\fences covering each distance and a maximum handicap of 100.


There is a small amount of overlap in handicaps so that trainers with horses in the lower\middle or middle\top handicaps will have a wider choice of races.

Again, we could have two runners in some of the handicap races.


This is only for discussion and trainers would be able to work out where their horses finished based on last seasons league would fit into this idea.

Would this type of schedule enable you to have most of your horses running each week?


Jim


Sun Dec 30, 2018 1:29 pm
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Post Re: Should We Start Planning\Discussing the League for SO7
Yes we do otherwise you be asking if we need 2yo races in the flat its about being close to Real racing if we stop Novice Races Cheltenham will be a 2 day Meeting.

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Sun Dec 30, 2018 3:02 pm
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Post Re: Should We Start Planning\Discussing the League for SO7
I am not sure what you mean by Cheltenham being a two day meeting. I admit I don't follow racing in real life but each week in the league we have 3 days of racing, you would have 10 x group races spread over 3 days plus 26 handicaps over the 3 days. Surely it must be possible to have a mixture Group races and handicaps making up a Cheltenham or any other courses' meeting.


Sun Dec 30, 2018 4:26 pm
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Post Re: Should We Start Planning\Discussing the League for SO7
I think u need novice races otherwise there's nothing special about the jumps and I think it's more important to get the flat right because more people play it .


Sun Dec 30, 2018 9:32 pm
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Post Re: Should We Start Planning\Discussing the League for SO7
The way I look at it is, novices races are mostly run of level handicaps and they are just more races for the top trainers to win, which the way things are is only about 6 - 8 trainers.

What I was really trying to convey with the schedule idea I layed out was the concept of having races organised in sets of 8 races that covered every distance every week at 3 different levels of trainer.

The top trainers had at least 10 x group races, one at each distance over hurdles\fences each week. If the concensus is that Novice races are important, then these 10 races could include novice and open races.

The bottom trainers had 8 x low level handicap races one at each distance over hurdles\fences each week

The other 18 handicap races, 2 at each distance over hurdles\fences each week, gave everyone a chance to enter at least 8 races at each distance over hurdles\fences each week and possibly as may as 18 races depending on the handicap of the horse.



With the existing schedule we had the top trainers complaining there wasn't enough races for their horses and the lesser trainers complaining there wasn't enough races for their horses. Also, there were some weeks where you would find that there was perhaps 3 x 2 mile chase races in one week and no 2m 4f chase races in the week or something similiar over other distances. This resulted in some races having small fields.


Mon Dec 31, 2018 6:36 am
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Post Re: Should We Start Planning\Discussing the League for SO7
personally think were a million miles off a league

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Mon Dec 31, 2018 10:23 am
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Post Re: Should We Start Planning\Discussing the League for SO7
pjrhodes1970 wrote:
personally think were a million miles off a league

I think the league could go the way of the dinosaur, people are already tired of the game.


Mon Dec 31, 2018 12:24 pm
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Post Re: Should We Start Planning\Discussing the League for SO7
I find this continued desire to do away with novices races by people who dislike or are disinterested in jumps racing in general rather offensive. Not that I think there will be a SO7 league in any case, not unless major changes are made after beta.


Mon Dec 31, 2018 11:32 pm
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Post Re: Should We Start Planning\Discussing the League for SO7
Sorry Josh but I think your reply is offensive. I have been an avid national hunt fan for 40+ years and I think the novice races do not fit. In terms of the game (not real life) could someone please tell me the difference between the Arkle and the champion chase or the supreme novices and the champion hurdle because as far as I can see they are contested by the exact same horses from the same trainers.
If reality is the issue then Coneygree 2015 gold cup, rule the world 2016 grand national, thistlecrack 2016 King George all won those races as novices so surely novices should be eligible for these races! Not to forget royal gait and alderbrook fairly recently in the champion hurdle.
I agree with Jim 100% and I raised it on a previous discussion and got shot down in flames then!!!
And whilst I’m on a rant why all the negativity about a SO7 league, the vast majority of comments about the breeding have been positive it’s only the hardcore league breeders who are complaining and claiming that it will be harder for the casual players; well the only way to test that is to have a league as I think it will be a leveller which is what everyone claimed they wanted.
Anyway rant over I’ve drunk too much and happy new year to each and every one of you ❤️


Last edited by Pommard on Wed Jan 02, 2019 8:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Tue Jan 01, 2019 1:05 am
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Post Re: Should We Start Planning\Discussing the League for SO7
Being sleep deprived makes me grouchy :).

The issue people have is not novices it’s that a select group of trainers, myself included, have so many good horses there is no difference, and the novices races are not of a lesser standard or contested by less experienced horses, and I take your point about novices contesting certain races in rl that this method of implementation prohibits. I just don’t see the answer being the compete removal of them. And it generally annoys me as the majority here seem to favour the flat and so see the jumps as the place to tweak to try and balance the results some, but god forbid we mess with the precious flat races or schedule.

As for SO7 somewhere between the outright luck or the fact everything you breed is worse than the parents, usually by some margin makes the whole process rather soul destroying. Still it might be exactly what’s wanted as I think at least some of those ‘hardcore’ trainers will skip it, so maybe the wins will spread out organically after all.

And I am reminded as I do the late night feed that this really does not matter to me any longer, too late to spoil the last so6 league, and though I never say never, not sure I shall be involved in so7.


Tue Jan 01, 2019 2:45 am
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