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Cruising Burst
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Author:  dangersteve [ Wed Jun 25, 2025 8:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Cruising Burst
Hi Chaps.

After reading up on some hints and tips for improving my horses I found a gamebred stallion with decent cruising burst (about 70%). I then bred with a bunch of mares to see what happened! Once I had them in the breeding barn as yearlings I could see 4 yearlings had 70%+ cruising burst which was great! So I started breeding a load more mares to the same stallion that season. Fast forward to my yearlings now entering the game as 2yo's, and those 4 horses cruising burst have dropped way down below 40-50% ?? Is this normal for stats to change between yearling and 2yo? Do those yearling stats come back as an older 2yo or 3/4 yo? Or is what they have at 2 pretty much it?

Thanks!

Any other tips for improving my chances of getting more league winners would be useful! I'm not shy about putting in the hours, but at the moment I'm not getting results... and my current game is 68 seasons in :shock:

Steve
Author:  delmonty1964 [ Wed Jun 25, 2025 9:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Cruising Burst
they do drop when come as a 2yo but almost doubles cruising burst as 3yo
Author:  ghosty [ Wed Jun 25, 2025 9:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Cruising Burst
Dels right, they go up about 25% from 2 to 3. In SO6 I had one cruise about 90 % but its lower in this game and if u get around 75% that's very good.

Even if they turn out to be not as good in league trials make sure u keep breeding with them. It might take a generation to pass on its ability.
Author:  Jim Murray [ Wed Jun 25, 2025 9:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Cruising Burst
Some trainers trial horses in big batches and that is ok when your stable is well established but in a new save, I trial my exported horses at the end of every season.
If I find a good horse in the construction kit (CK), I want it in the breeding as soon as possible in a new save.


There is something that Josh named the "JuJu". My interpretation of this is there is a hidden stat that effects how horses perform in the CK. This "JuJu" is hard to find but when you find a horse with the "JuJu" that horse will out perform any horse you have ever bred.
The only way to find this horse is to breed with every gamebred stallion in the barn and trial the foals. Once you find the "JuJu" horse you breed the hell out of it.
Sometimes the "JuJu" horses may not have the best green bars but that doesn't matter because it will perform really well in the CK.

How horses perform in the CK relates more closely to the league Racekit than how horses perform in the main game. I have had G1 winners in the league who hardly won a race in the main game.

In the breeding barn it is the best CK performers you breed together, ignore any in-game form.

When you look at the trainers near the top of the league, they have all found the "JuJu" horse.

After 68 seasons and little success in the league, I would start a new save. I think about 5 breeding seasons, John thinks about 10 seasons but whatever limit you chose you must find a horse with the "JuJu" and also horses with correct potential, extra speed and cruising burst. If I don't find the correct ingredients early on in a save, I start a new save and try again.

Hope this helps

Jim

ps- To give you some idea about the horses I uploaded this season

Druid Surfer. 1m 4f, won 3 from 3 this season, 97% potential at 3yo, 100% potential at 4yo, 88% extra speed, 84% cruising burst

My sprinters are closer to 93% extra speed and 65% cruising burst. The shorter distance horses probably need more extra speed, the longer distance more cruising burst.
Author:  Paul Parsons [ Wed Jun 25, 2025 11:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Cruising Burst
Whatever the value was of the cruising burst of your yearlings, that will return to them when they are 3yo's. My theory for the drop as 2yo's is the horses aren't mature and apart from a few mile or 1m2f races will only run over sprint distances. I could be wrong with the theory but I have never seen a horse not return to its original in its 3yo year.

You appear to be at the same stage I was last season. I had a few winners but for most part I was at least half a dozen lengths behind the action. I was just over 30 seasons in and decided to start a new save. That one is 41 seasons in but a big improvement on the original save. Everything I have running around in the league this season is from that new save with the exception of 'National' horses who come from the original save.

If you have the time to do it, it is worth putting in the effort.

Potential is the key stat - if you have a low bar in other categories you could still have a good horse, but not with potential, if that is low you can forget about it for racing (depending on other bars could be a handy breeder). As a rule I think most flat trainers would tell you that the potential percentage of their horses is high 90's as a 3yo and 100% as a 4yo (there will be exceptions). To achieve this the foal will need to be born with low 90% absolute potential, as for realised potential, the higher the better - in the 70's at birth preferably, but I wouldn't throw away a horse in the 60's without having trialled it.

Once you are consistently turning out higher potential horses then the extra speed becomes the all important stat in my opinion (I used to think cruising was more important, but my results over time suggest it is extra speed). The game will give you 100% extra speed - I have never achieved it, but I know of a few that have - but anything over 95% is what you should be aiming for. It will be easiest to find it in sprinters at first, the key is to try and breed it into the longer distance horses.

Cruising is the last piece of the puzzle, that combined with the potential and the extra speed is a formula for success. High cruising is hard to find especially in sprinters where it is less important. If you can get cruising of between 40 - 50% on your sprinters that is very good. For your mid distance horses you want to be looking to increasing that to between 50 - 70% and for your stayers 70% add upwards is preferable. Low to mid 80's would appear to be about the limit for this category.

The only other bar that might make a noticeable difference (from what I have seen with the extensive trialling I have done) is enthusiasm, it's not a critical one, but if you can find 100% then these horses seem to out perform those that don't have it - especially for NH horses.

Lastly - and I'm a bit of a hoarder when it comes to my stable so might not be entirely great advice - if a horse has the bars mentioned above but doesn't perform in the CK, don't throw it to the scrap heap straight away. It could be a performer in the breeding barn. Often in real life the out and out stars of the track don't make the best sires or dams. The same appears to apply to the game. Out of my flat stable running around in the league at the moment, around 15% of them come from the same sire, who was rubbish on track, yet year after year the best performing foals I'm producing are largely coming from him.

Good luck, there would appear to be some work ahead, but it is at least enjoyable work!
Author:  Jim Murray [ Thu Jun 26, 2025 12:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Cruising Burst
Paul Parsons wrote:

Potential is the key stat - if you have a low bar in other categories you could still have a good horse, but not with potential, if that is low you can forget about it for racing (depending on other bars could be a handy breeder). As a rule I think most flat trainers would tell you that the potential percentage of their horses is high 90's as a 3yo and 100% as a 4yo (there will be exceptions). To achieve this the foal will need to be born with low 90% absolute potential, as for realised potential, the higher the better - in the 70's at birth preferably, but I wouldn't throw away a horse in the 60's without having trialled it.


I agree with most of this but I think each save is slightly different as far as the percentages go. Some saves you see a big jump in potential from 2yo to 3yo and a small jump from 3yo to 4yo, other saves it is the other way around. I think you have to know the maximum difference between absolute and realised potential for your save. My flat save, the maximum my horses will improve is 22%.
My horses are 90-92% absolute potential as yearlings. I don't keep any horses below 68% realised potential.
If I trial a horse with less than 95% realised potential against my 100% realised potential they are a long way behind and I find they are too difficult judge how good they really are. In the first 25 seasons I might keep a low realised potential horse for breeding if the other green bars are really good but usually after that I have all the bars I need in horses with 100% realised potential.

My NH save, horses come into the stable at 2yo with 80% absolute potential, don't move at 3yo, go up 5% at 4yo, don't move at 5yo, go up 10% at 6yo and up another 5% at 7yo

As I said, each save can be different, know your own save.

Paul Parsons wrote:
Cruising is the last piece of the puzzle, that combined with the potential and the extra speed is a formula for success. High cruising is hard to find especially in sprinters where it is less important. If you can get cruising of between 40 - 50% on your sprinters that is very good. For your mid distance horses you want to be looking to increasing that to between 50 - 70% and for your stayers 70% add upwards is preferable. Low to mid 80's would appear to be about the limit for this category.


I think your ranges of cruising burst are too low for flat horses.
Sprinters - minimum 55%
Middle Distance - minimum 65%
Long Distance - minimum 75-80%



I have never noticed Enthusiasm & Confidence having any effect on my flat horses but in the NH they are both very important. I don't do much NH in the league but any horses in the NH that have been any good have at least 60% in both confidence & enthusiasm.
Author:  kniesh [ Thu Jun 26, 2025 11:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Cruising Burst
None of my horses entered on the flat have 100% Potential.

I'll elaborate more in a sec
Author:  ghosty [ Thu Jun 26, 2025 12:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Cruising Burst
kniesh wrote:
None of my horses entered on the flat have 100% Potential.

I'll elaborate more in a sec


Did u get 100%, the higher the other two big bars the more it takes of potential.
Author:  kniesh [ Thu Jun 26, 2025 12:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Cruising Burst
I think the CK rating is more important than the stats, an although it's not meant to officially exist, it clearly does.

IMO the CK rating (JUJU) has a much bigger spectrum than all the stats an my guess is it works like this;

1. Getting the 'massive JUJU' horse early on is the most important thing, I'd say within 10-15 seasons an just scrap the game if not. Without that your horses wont compete in the league at the group level no matter the stats. You can still pick it up after this, but it becomes much tougher to find

2. Always be breeding lines with horses who may not have the JUJU so long as they have the stats required. So I have lines completely. Once you have lines for just stats, start interbreeding them as much as possible. None of these need trialling at this point, just keep breeding to get the best looking stats you can.

3. Once your JUJU line is established, get as many good colts for differing distances an start to interbreed them with the good stats. At this point you will notice a massive jump in your trials, as the good stats get into your JUJU horses. An each time you get another stat added to what you have, you'll notice another jump in improvement

I think that the stats bar number work within the CK stat number if that makes sense. E.G. you get 95 CK Rating (JUJU), then working within that would be your green bar stats. If you max out all the important green bars, potential, cruise, extra speed within that 95, then your lines will stagnate at that ability. If you get the 100 CK Rating (JUJU) an get a 95 potential horse, then it's likely to surpass the ability of the 100 potential horse previously mentioned.

Obviously you never know what the JUJU Rating actually is (as it doesn't exist). BUT, an this is how I think I got my new game competitive in the league so quick. If you get a horse with inferior green bars than your best Trial horses but it suddenly beats them in the trials, it's advanced the secret CK rating. You should do everything you can to get the better stats into this

The bottom Green stats I think are important. I think having them all strong, may not improve ability necessarily, but once they're all very good, the horses consistency in performing to its top level, massively improves. It's not just the consistency stat. The more of those you improve, the more 'robotic' like you horse will be in performing

So make sure the CK Rating is top class, an you'll know when you see it in your trials. Then get all the stats you've developed within that ability. Those green numbers work within the top line CK Rating


Sorry about the ramble, this is just how my mind works it all out from trial an error anyway :)
Author:  kniesh [ Thu Jun 26, 2025 12:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Cruising Burst
ghosty wrote:
kniesh wrote:
None of my horses entered on the flat have 100% Potential.

I'll elaborate more in a sec


Did u get 100%, the higher the other two big bars the more it takes of potential.


I've got 100% extra speed in the league horses, an somewhere between 60-70% cruise, that does get up to 80 in my breeding, but not consistently yet. Most the potential is at 95-97.

I've just bred a horse over 10f now that has 100 potential, 100 extra speed, all the bottom stats required but only 53% cruise. This horse is my best horse in my trials over 10f an 12f now. I suspect this horse has scope to improve within the CK Rating stat as it is only just my best. I'll try to get better cruise in it to see. Once that cruise is in this line, I think it will just be about padding out my horses at that quality. They wont improve much beyond in this save

That horse was posted on Discord the other day, unfortunately she's a Filly
Author:  Lordedaw [ Thu Jun 26, 2025 12:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Cruising Burst
Go and have a look around in the LEGENDS EDITOR.

This will give you far more of an idea about how the bars work.

Some are out of 1000.

Some are out of 3.

Some don't even do what we think they do.

Also you will see some of the hidden stats like favoured month to race etc

When you create a legend you start off with a BASE FIGURE. This, I believe is the JUJU rating.

Every horse you breed gets one randomly and that becomes the multiplying factor for the bars I think. Which is why some bad bar horses are better than good bar ones.

Mind you as I am completely useless at this game I might be talking out of the top of my hat.

Still, it is worth having a look around in there.
Author:  kniesh [ Thu Jun 26, 2025 1:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Cruising Burst
Never seen that legend bit, but sounds like exactly what I mean

JUJU rating (this could be 0-100 rather than 0-10)

Within each Base Line JUJU Stat
1 - Potential 0-100 - Cruise 0-100 - ES 0-100
2 - same as above
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10

a 10 JUJU rating with 90 potential will beat a 5 JUJU rating with 100 potential. The mix you get within each JUJU base line is endless so you end up getting a lot different things working. Each distance you breed will likely depend on different combos of the above too. Like a sprinter will need more extra speed than cruise burst. A stayer will need more cruise than extra speed. What doesn't change is the better the potential, the better the horse. That's why that one is the most important. But you can get round it a bit
Author:  kniesh [ Thu Jun 26, 2025 1:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Cruising Burst
Lordedaw wrote:
Go and have a look around in the LEGENDS EDITOR.

This will give you far more of an idea about how the bars work.

Some are out of 1000.

Some are out of 3.

Some don't even do what we think they do.

Also you will see some of the hidden stats like favoured month to race etc

When you create a legend you start off with a BASE FIGURE. This, I believe is the JUJU rating.

Every horse you breed gets one randomly and that becomes the multiplying factor for the bars I think. Which is why some bad bar horses are better than good bar ones.

Mind you as I am completely useless at this game I might be talking out of the top of my hat.

Still, it is worth having a look around in there.


Gonna go an look at this legends editor bit now, learn something new every day :)
Author:  dangersteve [ Thu Jun 26, 2025 11:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Cruising Burst
Wow! Amazing guys! So much to process there, especially this JuJu rating magic trickery :shock:

Before I restart a new game, I have several questions.

Does it matter if you go manual training or auto? ( I usually go with the auto lazy option)

Does it matter if the difficulty level is set to hard or easy? (I usually set this to hard)

I don't know if this is right or wrong, but I tend to always start my new games off trying to establish good sprinting bloodlines, and then from there creep up the distance, usually to a max of 1m4f, I don't really have interest in longer races. Will this hold me back from finding the juju horse? Assuming the best way of finding it is to fill my breeding barn full of mares and breed to every stallion no matter the bred distance.

Once I have started a new game, to help find the juju horse, should I only trail horses from my new game, or can I mix them in with current game exports? Like, how obvious is this horse going to be? A total OMG this horse is amazing and beating everything in a canter by 6 lengths?

Are there multiple juju horses for different distances?

At the start of a new season I usually go through each new 2yo and all those with low potential I just remove from game immediately, is this wise while looking for the juju?

Once I've got the 2yo's I'll be keeping I skip forward a couple of weeks to mid January and then I export them and run a few trials at 5,6 & 7 furlongs to get a shortlist of the top 10 or so horses I'll keep for the season, the rest I usually sell or ditch, occasionally I'll keep the odd one if it has good stats.

I tend to export all my stable (2yo-4yo's) around the same time every year, and then run trails at Ascot from 5f-1m4f and on gd-sft & gd-frm. I usually do this in June, after each horse has had a couple of runs. Is there a perfect time of year to export horses for trails? (I understand if this is asking too much info, trade secrets and all that)

Does it matter how many races a horse has under it's belt before exporting?

Thanks chaps!

Steve
Author:  ghosty [ Fri Jun 27, 2025 12:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Cruising Burst
Always breed upwards on the flat, it's much harder to breed downwards.

I'd wait until August on the flat. Plus I only ran trails on good ground ,
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