Could have saved you a whole bunch of time if you had just asked. As I said this morning on the thread that was deleted, this was mentioned prior to the season starting and no issue was made, it was checked in the rules and there was no mention of it being a problem, and considering Mark is/was planning to put an option into the game to allow cross breeding to be done a lot easier, maybe this should have been covered earlier if such a taboo. Again, as mentioned this morning, this could have been easily covered up using an editor but wasn't as we were of the impression that this was within the rules.
Jamie sent me a bunch of horses to start again with after I deleted all my files. I then returned the favour, as did Luke I believe when Jamie deleted his saved game when trying to get the replays to play. Since then, I exchanged Coastal Path for Ghanaati for breeding purposes in both game and league.
As I explained to Colm, Morning Dew was pulled from my hard drive using file recovery software along with a number of other deleted files that were semi savable. Some worked, some didn't, and some were partly corrupted. That may be the cause of the issue, it may not, I can only tell you what I know. I have provided him with a list of others that I think I saved and that are running in the league for comparison. There was no hex or editing involved.
Either way it doesn't matter, the three of us had agreed to leave the league on a permanent basis this morning. It's a shame that some people are leaving the league because of this, while other are leaving the league because of the disastrous way this has been handled and what they can now see behind it. At least it has highlighted to some, the underground politics, plots and backstabbing going on which is a plus but that power struggle is one for another day no doubt, one I certainly don't have to worry or care about. In terms of some of the resignations today though, mission accomplished to some of you.

Regards this issue, no doubt most will see this as cheating or breaking of rules, or playing outside the spirit intended so to those I will appologise.

its a shame mate, but i for one do see it as cheating, If all 3 of you that are supposed to be involved had brought your intentions to the attention of all other league members and let them decide before it took place all this could have been avoided.
Enjoyed looking for your updates on stables/horses you had a little inside info on, hope you can stay involved on the forum in one way or another.
cheers
scotty

I agree with what you have said entirely.

Removing horses from one game and giving them to another trainer has always been planned as part of the league. The facility to implement this has now been coded into the game. No separate programs have been used to duplicate horses. No rules have been broken because no rules have been set. As I have said to others in the league, it may be against the spirit of the league but so is gelding and then breeding from those horses.

I have no doubts that if you were not successful, if your horses were crap like mine or if you belonged to a different clique this would be interpreted completely differently and as such the campaign against you has been purely vindictive and mired by jealousy. I don't know any of you that well but I am, and always will be, sticking up for what I believe is right and just.

Comparisons to Scatters, who tampered with game files in order to get ahead, are absurd and false.

I have no doubts that if you were not successful, if your horses were crap like mine or if you belonged to a different clique this would be interpreted completely differently and as such the campaign against you has been purely vindictive and mired by jealousy.

Well what do you say to me who has better horses than all 3 trainers put together..im not jealous or vindictive...I just feel the lower ranked trainers/newbies are at a total disadvantage and collusion between 3 top trainers to better themselves is totally wrong...
Im worried the league is on the brink of collapse and yes it's not all down to this issue...

Listen this is what I have to say on the matter,

Jamie had lost all his data sometime in March, I then sent him my files as a offer of generosity to get him started again fully aware of the intense hours of game play he put in understanding that he would use them as a kick start into producing his own crop in which he has done.

As far as I am aware TOM has no terms and conditions expressing the issue of shared horses, I am aware that neither have I agreed to a verbal contract nor a written one when signing up and can there for not be accused as cheating.

The only binding agreement I’ve managed to find is as follows;

[quote]
Before uploading any horses for the league, please note the following:
* Horse files entered into the league must be the original horse files. They can't be renamed clones.
[quote]

Definition of a Clone2. Genetics group of genetically identical progeny: a collection of organisms, cells, or molecular segments that are genetically identical direct descendants of a single parent by asexual reproduction, e.g. plant cuttings or grafts.

Given the literal rule that a clone is an exact genetic copy you have to ask the question how does a horse 100 years down the line become a clone? Furthermore, interpreting the quote I understand it to be uploading a horse then uploading the same horse under a different name, neither of which the 3 of us have done unlike others.

I therefore refused to be called a cheat, I have or neither have Jamie intentionally set out to gain an advantage over other users and you have to ask yourself why especially the work Jamie and DB have given to this forum alone.

The fall out is a mere shock to me and especially to everyone involved, it does seem like the toys are well and truly thrown out the pram and it's a shame for something blown out of proportion by an over extravagant member who's credibility has to be put to question.

I posted on the forum i had lost 60 seasons worth of horses after a system crash, no one offered me their horses to help me get started again, If i had been part of a clique , maybe that would have been different............

Well, I am a lower ranked trainer and couldn't care less. Many of us down the bottom of the table have no chance of competing, we simply dont have the time to invest. We take part for fun and coming 9th in a G1 with a 6th season upload, first homebred, is exciting.

The fact is that trainers on their own have consistently better horses than the so called conspirators proves that they are not at an unfair advantage.

Choosing Ghanaati as a good example (it was bolded in your post), it appears to have beaten yours in both the Queen Anne and the Falmouth? Just think, you could have had another G1 victory to add to your pile!

extravagant member who's credibility has to be put to question.

For the record i was just the messenger...I didn't find the collusion...

To suggest that politics, back stabbing, and jealousy played a part in this is absolute nonsense. There are stewards in the league whose job it is to check horses for anything unusual, the purpose of this is to ensure a fair playing field and to uphold the integrity of the league. If we don’t have these people doing this job there wouldn’t be any point in having a league. Also many of us are always giving out tips and advice to trainers, those that adopt them will become top trainers picking up wins from those that give the advice out, if jealousy was an issue we’d all be keeping such tips and advice to ourselves, but we don’t.

Choosing Ghanaati as a good example (it was bolded in your post), it appears to have beaten yours in both the Queen Anne and the Falmouth? Just think, you could have had another G1 victory to add to your pile!

The horse was put in bold because of the bloodlines....not because it beat my horse....not all newbies have your stance on the game...
I for one and not suggesting lifetime ban etc, i would be happy for all 3 to come back but imagine myself and crazy colluding..we would be thrownout for sure!!!...Its a shame as all 3 were good trainers in there own right and didnt need to swap horses...

You're an extremely confused individual, you believe we exchanged horses with each other to gain an advantage?

2 months down the line since files were swapped, 65+ years of breeding in my game, 3 different fillies attempted to beat Ghanaati and failed.

Your assumptions do not add up.

Luke



Post your words to Jim on yuku then he will decide.

Im off to bed!

Just got internet back on after moving whats going on?

No problem with that Scotty, if you and anyone else takes that opinion I have no problem at all. It was posted in plain view, before the start of the season, and nothing was said. Instead the debate rumbled on about using claimers to locate horses.
Anyhow, I'll certainly continue to contribute to other sections of this forum.

In response to Michael, I didn't mention jealously and I am not suggesting politics and backstabbing played a part in this being brought to light, I'm suggesting it played a VERY VERY big part in the way it was handled and the way it has played out, similar to the Scatters incident, and that some of those involved haven't been as subtle as they hoped, and certainly weren't counting on some interesting emails being kindly passed in my direction. Anyway, not my problem anymore, I'll just sit back, watch and act surprised at the right times. But that's another debate for another day.

To be honest we knew the emails were being passed about, wasn't an issue for me at all. The jealousy issue was something Rich raised and I just happen to disagree with him.