How do you know if you dont let someone else try and sort TOM out????

Clearly Dave is way to busy to help out at this moment, so let someone else have a go.

I know for a fact my girlfriend could help. You seem to be putting it off for some reason.

This is way people are getting frustrated. We cannot wait on one person, when there could be a solution to the problem here and now.

Come rich every one is waiting for season to start matey

Everything mike said is spot on!

And it is with no disrespect to dave and colm and what they have done it is simply looking to the future of the league!!

I've shown the lad I know the website, told him how the league works and what we want and he reckons it is pretty straightforward for a programmer to make a website!so I've asked him to get me some quotes

This season shud have started manually by now whilst workin towards new tom for future leagues! So many trainers,so much gameplay for so little league action!so4 has been out for 2 years for gods sake!

The fact is, whoever it is would need to speak with Dave to get the login codes etc. and in the time it would take to pass the reins I'm sure Dave could set everything up.

That said, if someone were to get in contact with me and I was comfortable with what they could do why would I say no?

You might guess from that no firm offer has come through yet.

Starting manually would add a big workload onto the league volunteers. It is the last resort. It's like walking to London because the taxi is 10 minutes late.

but rich dave cant do it all .... ask 4 help and lets begin

I've sent you an email asking for details on what needs to be done rich.

Dave much not have emailed you back?

I sent the email over a week ago now.

Just let ryan run the NH side manually, this waiting game is taking far to long now. Nearly 2 months waiting and we still have no update on were we are with Tom, and how long it's going to take.

We're talking about taking over Dave's TOM and re-doing it. I spoke to my house mate at university and told him the situation (he does game design/web development/IT sort of thing (don't know the exact course)). He said people programs in a way to suit them, not in a universal way unless they're professional; before offending anyone, i'm unsure of Dave's profession.

Though, with this in mind, why don't we look towards making a new website away from the current TOM website, in an universal & professional code so it's easy for people to step in and continue the work put in place initially. This would then be capable without hassling Dave from his frankly more important issues currently.

And for those who are continuously saying about Rich & Dave not getting a league sorted, it's not their fault! Imagine you having personal problems, then returning to the league being quite selfless and moaning about the league not starting & moaning isn't going to get the league started any quicker than it currently is.

I for one have always maintained that it is nobody's fault! What I'm saying is the return on investment of gameplay time for the league is appalling!one full season in two years!it is obvious that current setup of Tom is not working and I agree that we shud look to creating a new website for future leagues! To a programmer with experience it will be a piece of cake!

In the meantime I believe the league should go ahead manually that would be my vote!

I could have the Nhc run manually within weeks and it would be ran very smoothly and efficiently - sometimes you have to say enough is enough and from knowing how much time hemz Hooley padraig etc (and obv lots of others on flat side) then I'd say leagues need to start soon and become a consistent feature or we risk losing these guys!

The reason that there haven't been more seasons is down to the shameful conduct of certain league members who's sole purpose is to eradicate the fun because they care more about winning than taking part.

I would be very interested in any proposal or website design that could implement or better the current TOM features though. The SQL design does feel dated to me but it is a whole lot better than doing it by pen and paper.

Manually would be an absolute nightmare, you would have to take individual nominations from everyone for each race, find the horses in a folder and drag them together. After that it's pretty much the same process but TOM automates the first bit and saves about 2 hours work (at least, I've done it before when TOM wasn't working and it took me about 6 hours with breaks). TOM also spots any errors when you are uploading the results giving you a chance to re-run the race. If you add to that manual handicapping I would genuinely say that it would have to be one weeks race every 2 weeks in real life adding 3 months onto the season.

I'd prefer to wait a couple more weeks and do it properly.

i agree - if we were certain to be starting in a few weeks but confidence hasnt been inspired past few months really.

manually is a big job yes - but surely you would have an individual folder for each trainer and nominations would all be done on a thread. then each week its a case of putting each trainers horse into their races. for nhc this would take an hour max. after the race you simply note down new ratings to post on results thread at the end of the week (a 2nd persons job which is an hour max).

leaderboards were done manually on thread last year and would be done so again

With all the people playing this game there must be another web developer out there somewhere, not that it matters much to me, my performance in the league is the same as when the league isn't running

It's not anyones fault that we are getting delayed but it's hard to see an end in sight when every week we hear something like a few more weeks.

I would love the league to start right now and manually would achieve that. but manually is prob going to be a very big task and more than likely TOM will be sorted after a couple of weeks of the manual NHC causing more headaches. would NHC want to wait for flat to finish and align season starts next season, or would NHC want to just start up manually asap again??

I don't really think it is necessary to write a new TOM or do a re-design necessarily. We just need to have more than one person up to speed with TOM and be able to make changes. we can't put blame for delay on Dave for this, everyone has a life outside of SO. I also know it will take time to get up to speed. prob not feasible for now, but for the start of the next season we could look to get a couple of guys who know a bit of programming to try to get involved in TOM development???

The most important thing to know is that it will start and there will be at least 2 seasons before SO5.